18 responses right now ↓

• 1 Ihearu // Aug 14, 2009 at 3:45 pm

  I’m Dominican and I hear the nasty comments at family functions and it’s so annoying. I can’t stand it. The color issue is so deeply rooted in our culture it’s really despicable and frustrating to me. I understand why you would want to stop talking about it. It can be exhausting. You may think it’s falling on deaf ears but I hear you. You know what gives me hope your blog and the Blacktino website. I have read some of your posts and I can totally relate. My relatives on my fathers side are darkskinned and unfortunately most of the “moreno” remarks are made by them. Self-hate at its worse. I wish they would look in the mirror too and realize where they come from. The damage done by Trujillo has made such a mark on our people. On another note, throughout my life I have had crushes on Haitian men (as well as Panamanians, African Americans etc). When I mention it to my extended family I see a look of disgust on their faces. Some of my friends are Haitian and they have been nothing but wonderful to me. I’ve been privileged to have friends from so many different backgrounds. But my close friends are African American, Dominican or from other parts of the Caribbean. I really hope people will wake up and accept we do have African blood running through our veins instead of denying it. I want to personally thank you for voicing your views on the subject and I look forward to reading the next posts on your site.

• 2 admin // Aug 14, 2009 at 4:22 pm

  Ihearu -

  Thanks so much for your comment. I really appreciate it.

  I have other posts like this if you just scroll through the blog. Take a look at them.

  I never heard of the Blatino website. Have to look into it and read more. Thanks for including that.

  I totally hear you. My parents on one side are light and other dark, and I hear these conflicting views all the time.

  I hear the “you’re not black, your Dominican talk endlessly.” But it doesnt make any sense.

  I accept my latino heritage fully, but I can’t not look in the mirror and recognize me having black roots. Its not like this is a tan. Its permanent.

  I’m glad I’m running into a lot of non-ignorant, educated Dominicans on this issue. I know we are kind of the minority on this, so I wish I got a dissenting view on this every once in a while.

  But it is tiring and I’m going to stay away from it for a while. I mean, its just endless. We are talking about trying to change people’s views who are 50, 60, and 70. That’s not easy.

  Stay strong girl.

• 3 Ihearu // Aug 14, 2009 at 6:02 pm

  Thanks for taking the time to read my comment. There are quite a few of us but you’re right we are in the minority unfortunately. I’ll check out the rest of your posts. By the way here’s the link to the site http://www.blacktino.net/ Check it out it’s pretty interesting.

• 4 historia // Aug 15, 2009 at 12:12 am

  Hi Mr. Cabrera. According to some sources I’ve read 11% of the Dominican population is counted as Black. How does a Dominican define himself/herself as Black? Is it just the portion of the population that is of Haitian descent that identifies that way?

• 5 historia // Aug 15, 2009 at 1:29 am

  Now, I am going to add a comment. First, I’d like to thank you for your excellent website. I love to read your blogs and I’ve wanted to add my 2 cents for a long time, especially in response to Dominican Chronicles.

  As far as racism goes in any country in The Americas or Caribbean, we must realize that it comes from somewhere. It comes from “the old world” i.e. Spain, Britain, France. We must remember these were the colonial powers that came to “the new world” and claimed to discover several countries, regions, etc.

  Following the discoveries these powers exploited the lands and peoples that were living comfortably for centuries before the Europeans invaded.

  Europeans sought mineral wealth amongst other forms of riches but ultimately they were most successful in agricultural. Therefore, in the new world cotton , sugarcane and other forms of agribusiness reaped great financial rewards for the colonizers. However, they needed hands to do the work. So that lead to the slave trade.
  Of course, each power had its slave trading corporate entity. I believe their corporate mission was to find workers for the new world. Now depending on which country’s history we are discussing, all of the workers brought over were not necessarily Afro descendants. It may have been some Africans some Euros. They were brought over as indentured servants very different from enslavement. However, the demand for workers was so great, the slave trading entities made some “bad business decisions” which leaves hundreds of millions of people perhaps billions bickering, hating, killing each other today. You see those decisions were just as poor as the decisions made in recent times by corporate entities leading to our current global recession.

  The decisions were, one explore and trade with Africa for (human resources as well as other sources) i.e. the hands that would work the fields in the new world; two, highlight the difference between people to justify enslavement and the brutality often associated with it (therefore Black people were subhuman or somehow less worthy than Europeans).

  Each power handled that last point differently. I believe the Spanish empire allowed intermingling of its subjects of every race hence the rich melange of people in present day Latin America. However, I am certain there was a clear understanding that “Black was wack” the bottom of the barrel. So I suspect in many cases you were anything but Black once you were born of parents of different races. This may not be true of all Latin America but I’m sure it applies somewhere.

  In the case of the British Empire, I think it was absolutely clear you do not intermingle with the Negro. The truth is the rule was constantly broken. One of your respondents mentioned that the Latin Caribbean countries were all a mix of several cultures but I must say that is not exclusive to the Latin Caribbean. That is a “New World” experience. The issue is the degree of mixing. So getting back to my point on British style enslavement, masters often slept with slave women and bore children with them. One of the founding fathers of the USA was notorious for doing that with his slave mistress Sally Hemings. (See: The Hemingses of Monticello: An American Family by Annette Gordon-Reed, it is available at Amazon.com) In US society those mixed race children were often defined as Black, no questions asked. You see in the British empire (well certainly the USA) one drop (well at least one “known” drop) of Black blood was all that was required to be defined as a Negro. So you find people throughout the English speaking world of every hue many looking white defined as Black. Some people defined as Black (who may very well be majority European, if they could trace their blood line) have even been able to live as Whites. That is known as “passing”. (See” One Drop: My Father’s Hidden Life– by Bliss Broyard) Many may do so successfully but often it comes with tragic outcomes.
  I must add, I’m a black man almost as dark as can be and I know who my white ancestor is. I’m not African-American but in my country we knew we were Black in spite of the white lineage. That is something that is probably true for most Blacks in the New World whether in Canada, USA, Caribbean down to South America. Most of us have some white blood, even if we are dark skinned. The difference is that the white ancestor wasnt Daddy, he was the Master, so there was no love, no family linkage just a blood line.
  So ultimately, each empire and later each nation built itself using various ideals, mores, etc.

  In the Dominican Republic I believe being black (or I’ll say negritude) was demonized because of its history with Haiti. Since Haiti’s citizens are usually darker, (with numerous exceptions, I must point out) that darkness was defined as savage, subhuman, comida de puercos. The slight difference in shade between the majority population of each country gave DR’s leaders a point to unify the country and today you have that deep racism. It is nothing new or unique it is simply the way of the new world with a Dominican twist.

  What does throw a wrench in all of that is the fact that global forces cause us to relocate for better opportunities. So like any other living creature Dominicans have immigrated to this society USA and elsewhere. I think if most Blacks knew the thinking of Dominicans they’d be amazed. How can these folks (who are usually brown maybe the same color as me or my momma or darker) hate Black people. It is shocking, well it was to me when I first read about and eventually witnessed it. My concern is that the young ones will carry the racist torch. You have mentioned several times that the ancianos uphold the racist views but I beg to differ. I have heard numerous people younger than you and academically brilliant spout some deep seated racist remarks. So my question is what will happen when these young people get to positions of power (maybe President of the USA) will they bring back a Trujillo-style government, will they bring us back to the past to a Jim Crow United States?

  Well, I’ll end there and thanks again for your blog. I enjoy reading all of it, not just Dominican Chronicles.

  I’ll add some more links for you and the bloggers to look over. At least one of your countrymen has touched on the issue of Dominican Blackness or the African Presence there.

  Another note, Dr. Gates, the Harvard African-American professor who was recently arrested in his own home and you have made mention of in this blog is supposed to be 56% white. Some African Americans have even brought up that point and don’t pity his unjustified arrest for that reason. Have you seen the two series he did on African-Americans and their ancestry?

  Racism from wherever is just sick.

  Thanks Mr. Cabrera, you’re a gentleman and a scholar.

  Peace.

  (See the “Introduction to Dominican Blackness by Silvio Torres-Saillant, 1999)
  http://www1.ccny.cuny.edu/ci/dsi/publications.cfm

  Google: “Theophilus John Syphax” in quotes for an interesting story.

  http://www.amazon.com/Hemingses-Monticello-American-Family/dp/0393064778

  http://www.amazon.com/One-Drop-Fathers-Life-Secrets/dp/0316008060/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1250317725&sr=8-1

• 6 historia // Aug 15, 2009 at 1:36 am

  oops. forgot a link.

  http://www.pbs.org/wnet/aalives/

• 7 anotherdominican // Aug 16, 2009 at 9:30 pm

  Race/color is actually one of the smaller problems to deal with in dominican community compared to poverty, teen pregnancy, drug use/drug dealing, homelessness, domestic violence, low-level labor skills, lack of education, unemployment, money mismanagement….and so on. Besides the whole race thing is actually bigger than being a dominican thing….its kind of universal experience even among racially homogenous groups…meaning even before european colonialism, there has been a human cultural preference for light vs. dark. Asian and Indian civilizations illustrate this. Even African Americans have color issues. Frankly, dominicans are no more colorsstruck than other groups…its just that its a tad more perverse because there are many virtually all african descent dominicans. So to look at an Af-am and say “you repulse me” when the dominican saying it is literally a mirror image, just seems…odd(understatement).

• 8 historia // Aug 16, 2009 at 10:28 pm

  i love this blog. i sent like 3 comments early aug 15. none appeared. am i doing something wrong?

• 9 admin // Aug 17, 2009 at 12:21 am

  historia -

  Wow. That’s a great response. I really appreciate it and the kind words.

  I agree with every word you said in your post. The color lines were drawn and its no diff than the US in the early 1900’s.

  I also agree that young Dominicans, mostly who immigrate here, have more racist talk than the ones who are born here. Yet, there are many born here who speak that racist crap too.

  Like I said before, I’m not here trying to label all Dominicans black. Dominicans are a mixture of white, black, and taino indian.

  I’m not even trying to label myself black. But what I do understand is that I’m a Latino of African descent; and why I talk about this so much, is because im sick and tired of hearing all this racist crap from people who obviously have black in their blood as well.

  From friends, friends parents, family members, etc. Like…i’m just sick and tired of it. Really am.

• 10 admin // Aug 17, 2009 at 12:22 am

  anotherdominican -

  There are other more pressing issues and that’s why I’m kind of taking a break from this never ending topic.

  Poverty, education, crime are topics that need to be touched on. Also, the good in the community. It’s easy to be negative and I’m guilty of that. There’s stuff that we are happy about as a people and those things will get displayed.

• 11 Goddess Intellect // Aug 17, 2009 at 10:14 am

  Please dont stop with this series…Im not Dominican but I think its is so important to address these issues & I am learning so much from you on the topic…does it not help ease your frustration to get it out in blog form?
  It would be powerful to actually interview or get video footage of someone who stands behind these beliefs…because its not just in the latin american communities..its allllllll over the black diaspora…we need to connect soon because I think my readers would benefit from a mini series on being black in america from a bi-racial (me) & latino point of view…ppl need to wake the eff up for real

• 12 inmanhattan // Aug 17, 2009 at 2:54 pm

  Thanks for this site in general. I love reading your posts.

  I know in my own family (older generations) some of the family was extremely anti-black. BUT as time has gone on, the younger people in my family have integrated themselves into the more mixed society so we have met more people from various backgrounds, sexual orientation, etc. therefore busting away from the prejudice. My brother is currently engaged to an African American woman, and some of the oldies are upset, but no one else cares.

  Our area (Inwood) is not very diverse, and that can be an issue at times. On the one hand, we want our own ethnic community surrounding us but if no one ever pokes their head out of that immediate circle, we as people don’t learn anything. Most people are afraid of the unknown, and if you never leave the neighborhood to poke around somewhere else and get to know people who are not like you, then this feeling of I am better than you continues on through the years. Now I know this particular situation runs deep and most likely won’t be fixed by people reaching out to others, but I am happy to see there are younger people saying, “This is ridiculous”.

  I have always felt this city is kind of crazy because we are so diverse but every group has their own area of the city and no one intermingles. It’s sad! I read somewhere that Queens is the most diverse borough in the city, and I have to say when I lived there all of my neighbors were different ethnicities and everyone got a long. I have always been impressed by that.

• 13 admin // Aug 17, 2009 at 3:06 pm

  Goddess Intellect -

  We keep talking about collaborating, but we never find a concrete idea . Lets set a goal – by the end of this month, we have a topic we can both share on our sites.

  I’m not going to stop the series, I may just not touch on the whole race issue for a while.

  imanhattan -

  Thanks for visiting and im glad more people are stopping by to comment.

  New York City is extremely diverse when you walk in the street, but when you go into certain neighborhoods, its majority this or that.

  I completely agree that people trap themselves in neighborhoods, and Latinos seem to do that more. I know people in my hood who haven’t been to Queens or Brooklyn just to even walk around. Its crazy.

• 14 historia // Aug 17, 2009 at 9:59 pm

  Thanks for your response. I can understand your frustration with the racism topic, but in your response you make another valid point. As a Latino you have a choice. You acknowledge you are a Latino of African descent. What about people who are just “black”? Do you know how much negativity that carries, very often undeserved. Truthfully they should be American, Canadian, Brazilian, Jamaican, Nigerian not just “black”. Tiger Woods shouldn’t be just “black”. Anyway, keep up the good work.

  Peace

• 15 Goddess Intellect // Aug 18, 2009 at 12:25 pm

  sounds like a plan..by the end of the month

• 16 KT // Aug 20, 2009 at 10:03 pm

  in manhattan,

  love you Aug 17 post. Very very on point and true.

• 17 KT // Aug 22, 2009 at 2:56 pm

  Historia, responding to your post on this message board and on your questions if I read your post above on the “dominican identity” message board.

  Very well written entry.

  I think we all just have to live above the negativity. Call out ignorance when we see it, and try not to let it affect you. History tells us the facts, those who are unaware of their history or deny their history will continue to be ignorant. Not only do many people not know their own history, but many do not know the history of the country they are relocating to. I think this is one of the reasons why the INS enacted a more stringent citizenship test, more focused on US history etc. (although studying for the test does not really teach you much about US history)

  I think people are also a product of their communities. We tend stick to what is comfortable and formulate perceptions of the unknown. I think traveling outside the tri-state area, to the west coast, the south, mid west, truly interacting and discovering America can change ones perception on life and themselves. I think if all you know is inwood/wahi, the Bronx and DR, your perception and outlook is pretty limited. One of the reasons why NYC politicians often have a hard time on the national political stage is because NYC does not wholly representation the mood/views of America.

  I think traveling the US would be an eye opener for many inner city NYC residents, especially NYC latinos. Travel to the west coast and the sunbelt where Mexicans are the majority latino group. Take a city like LA where Mexicans are over 50% of the population . Where many are 3 and 4th generation Mexican Americans, who are successful and are a part of mainstream society and the political process. A contrast from the day laborers we see here on the East Coast and in the media. The latino experience is completely different outside of NYC and the East Coast. What strikes me as well is the negative tone I hear from many caribbean latinos (specifically Dominicans) in regards to Mexicans. The truth is on the national scale Mexicans represent the largest percentage of latinos in the US. Hard to imagine based on what we see here in NYC.

  I think travel to other latin countries as well can shape ones perception. I’m not sure how many Caribbean latinos travel to other latin countries other than their native country. But from my own travels in central and south america, the racial experince is different. Take for example Panama, which was a fusion of cultures. I found the people i interacted with proud of who they are, brown, light and dark skin people proudly identified as black or mixed. Native indigenous indians proudly identified as native amerindians, and so on. Although I didn’t see it first hand, i’m sure underlying racial issues exists. But I found it interesting how people described and labeled themselves. In Chile everyone thought I was Brazilian. In a country that is majority European descendants, everyone was fascinated and loved my brown skin.

  So i think what I was getting at with this long post, is that too often we get so consumed with what’s right infront of us, and we forget the world is a dynamic place, with beautiful and dynamic people. And sometimes we have to take some refuge from whatever ignorance that surrounds us, to realize that not everyone is ignorant, and that life is beautiful. Yes, in a perfect world we would experience this every day; but the world is not perfect.

  I leave with one question. Understanding that many Dominicans do not like to be called black by american blacks or americans (of any race/ethnicty) what are the feelings when other latinos call you black? say you travel to mexico, cuba, columbia, etc and are referred to as black? is it a different experience given you are not in the US and black doesn’t have the same connotations?

• 18 historia // Aug 22, 2009 at 5:42 pm

  Thanks for your response KT.

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